Nick Gowing, the bbc presenter: ... And how much was that pressure important in getting this passed, in getting consensus on it, John?

John Doerr, venture capitalist: Well, it was not pressure, it was reason and … [laughter]. If you look at California as a nation – it’s the fifth largest economy in the world. And so, for California’s leaders to decide – they’ll have mandatory reduction of greenhouse gases by 25 percent. I dare say that law was the most important piece of legislation in 2006 and it may be the most important law of this decade, worldwide! This is a major step forward and I didn’t have to lobby or push the speaker. He was leading.

Nick Gowing, the BBC presenter: We need to discover, though, how much that could be reflected in other states of the United States and around the world in countries like India, in countries like China, whether you think that the California model is something is something which could be taken off the peg by many politicians and adopted?

Fabian Nunez, Speaker, California State Assembly: I would dare to say, how can we say to countries like India and China: “You must take drastic measures now to combat global warming, when as a nation the United States isn’t doing the right thing?” This is why we decided to act in California, because we wanted to put pressure from the bottom up to our Federal Government. It’s simply is not good enough for our President to recognize that there’s a problem. We’ve got to act; we’ve got to take leadership and we cannot impose our will on other countries if we ourselves are not doing the right thing by curbing global warming.

Nick Gowing, the BBC presenter: Vikran Akula!

Vikram K. Akula, CEO, SKS Microfinance, India: What’s happened in California is fantastic, but let’s be very clear: at the United States, Australia in terms of the failure of leadership – the President, President Bush makes one phrase in a fifty minutes’ speech about climate change. The fact is that five percent of the population of the world – the population of the United States is responsible for 24 percent of carbon emissions. And it’s not enough to do talking things in certain places, California being an exception because it’s a real model. But the fact that Senator Chambliss and others are still questioning the scientific evidence shows how much farther countries like the United States, countries like Australia need to go in terms of leadership. And I also add that in terms of a model for developing countries, whether it be China and India, it is not that they can’t be between development and environmental protection. There can be models of development that are environmentally sound. And California is showing that we can do that, so it’s not a question of development or environmental protection. There are strategies to do both and that’s what we need to do both in the West, as well as in the North.

Nick Gowing, the BBC presenter: Senator Chambliss, do you fear that you’re behind the curve and you should be taking a massive lead forward as a Senator for a state, which clearly is suffering?

Saxby Chambliss, Republican Senator for Georgia, USA: I don’t think we’re behind the curve. I think this issue is moved to the forefront. I think, obviously, that’s where it needs to be from the discussion standpoint. You are having scientific discussions about this and scientists said…, or changing their minds now about some of these issues and nobody seems to have the real solution to the problem.

Nick Gowing, the BBC presenter: So you don’t accept that the science now is essentially clear? [overlapping]

Saxby Chambliss, Republican Senator for Georgia, USA: I would disagree significantly with you about that. I think there are a number of very well recognized scientists, who are saying that this is not the manmade problem, that [unintelligible] it was.

Nick Gowing, the BBC presenter: OK, I don’t to get stuck on the science because there is an overwhelming consensus, I think, which disagrees with you certainly here and in many parts of the word. But Dan Esty!

Dan Esty, Yale Centre for Environmental Law and Policy: On that point. One of the hallmarks of environmental issues is that it’s always uncertainty. So we can’t let the fact that there are uncertainties about regional impacts, the scale of the impacts, the timing slow us down. We have enough information to move forward to other quick points. We need to have a legal underpinning to motivate the kind of economic activity that John Doerr wants to invest in and that Klaus Kleinfeld will make money with his company producing. But you can’t create those markets without a legal structure. So, it’s very important that we are clear that there’s a role for government here. The speakers led the way in one state but I won’t agree with the Senator on one point – we will do much better if that’s a global market based on a global commitment and there can be different levels of obligation: European Union will come down, the U.S. should come down about the same amount. China maybe gets a growth target. But targets for everyone would create a bigger incentive for innovation, for action on the ground, for the kind of investment that the venture capital community can bring to bear. And that’s where we are to come with solutions. It’s creativity, it’s harnessing the power of the market, it’s bringing those venture capitalists along into this activity. That’s critical.

(To be continued, see Unit 11, Text 11.3.)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/, 27.01.2007